She’s Back And Forth With Him AND Other Guys??? | Doc Love - Dating Advice For Men

She’s Back And Forth With Him AND Other Guys???

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(Editor's Note, this letter was written before Doc's death in August, 2020 but still relevant as Doc's principles are timeless).

Hi Doc,

I am a dedicated follower of your principles and truly feel you’ve got it all figured out. There is a situation I would like your advice on. Here are the details.

I began dating Leigh two and a half years ago. In the beginning I was unaware of how powerful Challenge really was. I was a Challenge without even knowing it. When we first started going out I even said to her, “I don’t have to call you every day, do I?”

For the first six months Leigh was a wildcat. She was a blast to hang out with and appeared to have a tremendously high level of interest in me. However, she is from a family very impressed with money and they’re always telling her to “marry up.” I come from a modest background but was able to provide her with lots of the things she wanted.

After a year I found out that her ex-boyfriend of 10 years (who by the way is filthy rich) started calling her. She said she wanted to be friends with him again, but being a guy, I knew better. I was concerned and jealous.

We ended up breaking up a few months later because Leigh said she felt like something was missing. She even said that I wasn’t being a Challenge, there was no chemistry, and that I didn’t stand up to her enough. The funny thing, though, is that she didn’t start dating her ex-boyfriend. That’s when I fell into your hands and started reading your articles.

I went back to being a Challenge, not calling and saying I love you all the time, and after a few months we got back together. Then I got a job and had to move to another state for nine months. We decided we could do the long-distance thing. During my eighth month away, Leigh bought me a birthday gift and gave it to me a week early when I was home visiting, but she forgot to call me on my birthday.

I got very upset with her and she apologized. We made up, and she invited me to spend the Fourth of July with her and her parents at the beach. The first night things were great. The next day, though, she was distant. She went to visit her girlfriend and didn’t return any of my phone calls for a week. When she got back she finally called and again said that she didn’t feel any chemistry.

Some time later I ran into her when she was with another guy. I made out like I was doing okay, but deep down I still had feelings for her. I waited a week, called her, and left a message that I thought she was looking good. She called back, and when I didn’t return any of her messages she begged me to call. A week went by and I asked her out. It was apparent she was still single. She called me the day after our date and told me how much fun she had and that she’d like to see me again.

I waited another week to call and asked her out again. This time things were different. She was distant again, but I continued to try to be light and funny. I haven’t spoken to her since.

How can a girl who says she doesn’t feel chemistry for you one day turn around and be intimate with you the next, then go cold again? It’s so confusing; Doc. Is there anything I can do to turn Leigh around at this point?

I would love to know what you think I should do now. I love Leigh, but I don’t understand her.

Loren - who can hardly take it anymore


Hi Loren:

First off, you’re not a dedicated follower of my principles. Know how I can tell? Because you’re asking me a mile-long question here. If you were really a Doc Love disciple, you’d have my principles memorized and be able to figure it all out. You’d already know the solution to your problems.

But that’s not the issue here. I’m here to help you and every other guy out there.

You were unaware of how powerful Challenge is? I’ve been telling you from day one that it’s NITRO! But you guys still don’t believe me. Think about it. You had Leigh eating out of your hand for six whole months with a throwaway line like “I don’t have to call you everyday, do I?” Talk about a master of Challenge!

So, Leigh was a blast for six months. That means in the seventh month she wasn’t such a party anymore – because her Interest Level was taking a nosedive. Because, Loren, you were doing something different. You changed something. You started morphing into some form of Wimpus Americanus. What it boiled down to is that you stopped being a CHALLENGE. And Interest Level will decline from there on out.

Don’t fool yourself, man. Money was never an issue with Leigh. During those first hot six months, Interest Level cut through everything, right? Leigh knew you weren’t the second coming of Warren Buffett when you pulled up for the first time in your secondhand Toyota. When her Interest Level was 95% she couldn’t care less whether you drove a Mercedes or were collecting unemployment insurance. (To you Psych majors, he was between careers!) For six months you owned this girl's heart. Then you didn’t anymore.

When her rich ex came into the picture, you should have said to her, “Hey, baby, bring him over and we’ll have lunch. I’d really like to meet the man. In fact, I’d be honored.” On the inside you were thinking of taking a hit out on the guy, but on the outside don’t ever show that anything gets to you. Sure, you should have been concerned, but not jealous. Instead, you should have been asking yourself “Why is she talking about exes? Why is she talking to other men? Why isn’t she a blast anymore? What the heck am I doing wrong?”

You two didn’t break up, Loren. Leigh dropped you. We don’t break up with women – they drop us. Get it? Sure, something was missing for her – 51 points of Interest Level! It was 100% for around 180 days, but you managed to lower it to 49%. That’s the missing “chemistry” she was talking about. Chemistry is the twin sister of Challenge.

When Leigh accused you of not standing up to her, what she meant was that you have no backbone, you’re no fun, and you’re boring – but don’t take it personally. And you wonder why she’s talking to the exes?

By the way, Loren, how do you know Leigh wasn’t dating her rich ex? Did you have someone tailing her with a camera? You don’t have enough money to hire someone like that. Her rich ex-boyfriend does, though.

It’s too bad you got to me after the damage was done, buddy. It’s nice that you tried to go back to being a Challenge, but 90% of you guys do it way, way too late. You don’t realize that what the girl saw in you at the beginning she wants to see after 40 years. What she doesn’t want is someone who’s predictable and no fun.

Moving out of state for your new job was the kiss of death. Now I know that somebody upstairs was looking out for this girl! You were forced to get out of town in your tenuous position with Leigh? Talk about things going wrong! Murphy’s Law loves you.

Do you know why your birthday slipped Leigh’s mind? Because women only call when their Interest Level is somewhere between 51% and 100%. I know this is tough for you to swallow, but it’s the truth. But then you pouted. Great! Guess what pouting does to Interest Level? I’ll give you a hint – it’s like driving a stake through a vampire’s heart.

At that point you should have turned down Leigh’s invitation for the Fourth of July, told her you had other plans. The reason things were great on the first night was because she was putting on an act. But then she ran out of gas. She got tired of fighting her resentment for you and decided to let it out. Screw it, she figured – this guy’s such a drag I’m going to shoot him a dirty look every time I see him. Resentment isn’t pretty.

But you must really be addicted to pain and torture, Loren, because you still hadn’t had enough. You went and left phone messages to extend your own pain.

Then Leigh confesses to you a second time that she has no feelings for you and what do you do? Like every other male, you chase her! Makes sense, right? Really smart. What a great idea. Seeing the results you got, maybe I should change my philosophy on women!

And after all the punishment you absorbed, you still have feelings for her. That’s okay. You’re not a robot, and I’m sorry you’re in pain, my friend. But you forgot to memorize my stuff. You should have come to me about a month before you met this girl to get all my rules down, and if you had, right now Leigh would be with you. But instead she’s now in the arms of some old, filthy rich boy.

Don’t be fooled because she begged you to call her. Know what was really begging? Her ego. Not her Interest Level. Because when it’s 40% to 49%, they give you false hope. You were getting scraps, dude. And then it just gets worse until it peters out altogether. That’s why when it’s over, it has to be “Adios, baby!”

So, it was apparent that Leigh was still single? Talk about grasping for straws! She wanted to see you again? Hey, maybe you two are meant for each other after all – this girl’s a real ding-dong!

At best, though, her Interest Level is bouncing all over the place like a ball in a pinball machine: 43% to 41% to 46%, etc. Here’s what the inside of her head sounds like: “I’ll call him back…I’ll break the date…Maybe I’ll see him…Nah, I won’t see him,” etc. And when she finally cuts you loose forever, you’ll sit there like a dope and look back at the massive amount of time and energy you wasted and how empty your wallet is. You could have wrapped this up a lot sooner, man. If you didn’t make so many mistakes, you wouldn’t need a bailout program.

Know why Leigh goes back and forth so much? Because women will make out with you when their Interest Level is ricocheting between 40% and 49%. And you guys think, well she’s kissing me, so she can’t really be on the way out. But the fact is you’re already out and don’t even know it.

You don’t have a chance with this girl, Loren. Forget her. Go back to your old ways of being a great Challenge.

If it helps any, I understand Leigh perfectly. For six months her Interest Level was 95%, then it went to hell and you were history. It’s that simple.

Remember, guys: she doesn’t want just you; she wants you and Doc Love’s principles forever.

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